Ken MacLeod's comments.
The title comes from two quotes:
“If these are the early days of a better nation, there must be hope, and a hope of peace is as good as any, and far better than a hollow hoarding greed or the dry lies of an aweless god.”—Graydon Saunders
Contact: kenneth dot m dot macleod at gmail dot com Blog-related emails may be quoted unless you ask otherwise.
Emergency Links
British Red Cross
Disasters Emergency Committee
UNICEF
Hurricane Relief
American Friends Service Committee
LINKS
Self-promotion
Buy my books
Buy signed copies!
Follow me on Twitter!
The Human Genre Project
The Human Genre Project
Comrades and friends
Charlie Stross
Martin Wisse
Making Light
Avedon Carol
The Pagan Prattle
Cheryl's Mewsings
Farah Mendlesohn
Bridesmaid
Svein Olav Nyberg's old blog
Svein Olav Nyberg's new blog
Alister Black
Kevin Williamson
Alan Freeman
Kathryn Cramer
MaxSpeak
Jim Henley
John Baker
Nicholas Whyte
The Sharp Side
Barbaric Document
The Woolamaloo Gazette
Kevin Carson
Thomas Knapp
Arthur Silber
Grand Hotel Abyss
Devizes Melting Pot
A Finer World
Austro-Athenian Empire
The Art of the Possible
Cupcake Couture
Brian Micklethwait
Diane Hannover
TJ's Place
Mat Coward
Iain Fraser Grigor
Gail Wendorf
ubiquitous surveillance
Dubious Prospects
Ilorien
Sharon King
Kristine Lowe
Rich Puchalsky
Lamontations
Cory Doctorow
Parallel Futures
Lord Dunderheid
Colleagues
Genomics Forum
Genotype
Forum Tweets
the write reality
Pippa Goldschmidt
My Forum page
Sociology, Genomics and SF
EUSci
The University of Edinburgh
Genomics
What Is Genomics?
What is Synthetic Biology?
SynBioStandards
Genetic Future
Genetic Inference
Action Bioscience
Cardiff sciSCREEN
Genomic Minds
The Fourth Domain
Edinburgh
Guardian Edinburgh blog
The Edinburgh Reporter
City of Literature Trust
Textualities
Writers Bloc
Word Power
Transreal
McShandy's
Forest Publications
The Forest Cafe
Avalanche Records
Scottish Knife Collection
Sea Kist
Joyce Paton
Chris Koujou
Author Portraits
Luath Press
Tychy
Dig-In Bruntsfield
Writers Blog
SF Writers' blogs
Dead by Dawn
Forbidden Planet
Ian McDonald
The Mumpsimus
Dr Ian Hocking
Barbaric Document
Mundane SF
Justina Robson
Neal Asher
Michael Rosen
Warren Ellis
John Scalzi
Sean Williams
Jack Deighton
Rudy Rucker
Glenda Larke
Alan Campbell
Gavin Inglis
Hannu Rajaniemi
Lou Anders
Nick Harkaway
Paul McAuley
Lois McMaster Bujold
LabLit
M. John Harrison
Kelley Swain
Robert J. Sawyer
Will Shetterly
Stefan Pearson
aiko writes: poems
The Lost Book
The Trease Project
Peter Watts
Karla Schmidt
Deborah J Miller
Juliet E McKenna
Mike Cobley
Philip Palmer
Nick Wood
Catherynne M. Valente
Gail Carriger
Liz Williams
Morag Edward
Adam Roberts
Jo Walton
Nicola Griffith
Alastair Reynolds
Kari Sperring
Alan Bissett
My Writing Life
Helen Jackson
Caroline von Schmalensee
N. K. Jemisin
Cici James
Joan Slonczewski
Gwyneth Jones
Michael Rosen
Ryan Van Winkle
C.J. Cherryh
Russell Jones
Georgina Bruce
Katrina Leno
Claire Askew
Steven Brust
Mary Robinette Kowal
Regi Claire
Ron Butlin
Ruth Sabath Rosenthal
Jaine Fenn
Nnedi Okorafor
Editor Blogs
John Jarrold
Publisher Blogs
Tim Holman
Brother Blogs
MacLeod Cartoons
Skiffy
Ansible
Redstone SF
Futurismic
SciFiDimensions
io9
Tor.com
Pyr
Orbit
PS Publishing
Feminist SF
World SF News
Biology in SF
Raritania
Steampunk Fashion
Torque Control
Post-Weird Thoughts
Ivor W. Hartmann
StarShipSofa
Star Wars Modern
The Outer Alliance
Eve's Alexandria
Beyond Victoriana
Strange Horizons
Salon Futura
Afrocyberpunk
pornokitsch
SciFi Ideas
Three, If By Robots
Brits Blog
The Sharpener
The Register
Velvet Glove, Iron Fist
Blood and Treasure
The Gaping Silence
The Yorkshire Ranter
Excuse Me Whilst I Step Outside
' ... a treeless, flowerless land, formed out of the refuse of the Universe, and inhabited by the very bastards of Creation'
Socialism First!
Red Paper
Aye We Can!
Bella Caledonia
Scottish Roundup
Scottish Politics
SSP
Solidarity
Scottish Left Review
Democratic Left Scotland
Between the Hammer and the Anvil
SNP Tactical Voting
A Place to Stand
Freedom and Whisky
Independence
Gerry Hassan
Better Nation
Bright Green Scotland
Caledonian Mercury
Lallands Peat Worrier
Lesley Riddoch
Clyde Space
Spaceport Scotland
Land Matters
Scottish Review
Scottish Review of Books
The Firm
STV Local
Frontiers
Whitehall 1212
Ian Smart
Notes from North Britain
Amazing Things
Astronomy Picture of the Day
Hubble Telescope
Fragile Oasis
Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy
Dictionary of the History of Ideas
Internet SF DataBase
Arts and Letters Daily
3 Quarks
1911 Britannica
Wikipedia
BBC
Daily Mash
Fortean Times
BoingBoing
Three-Toed Sloth
James P. Hogan
MemeMachineGo!
small WORLD
Derelict London
Good News
Strange Maps
The Simulation Argument
Better Living Through Chemistry
Poems on the Book of Life
The Periodic Table of Science Fiction
RAW Illumination
The Realist Archive
The New Atlantis
Faith
Flat Earth
Fixed Earth
Geocentricity
6 ky Earth
10 ky Earth
4.5 Gy Earth
Creation Wiki
Sacred Texts
The Brick Testament
The LOLcat Bible
Reason
New Humanist
Edinburgh University Humanist Society
WTA
IEET
Cyborg Democracy
Nick Bostrom
Bad Astronomy
WorldChanging
Cosmic Variance
Sean Carrol
Bruce Schneier
i-studies
The Eternal Golden Braid
The Secular Web
NSS
Richard Carrier
Russell Blackford
Conscious Entities
David Chalmers
the Edge
Naturalism.Org
Talk Reason
Stephen Law
Science after sunclipse
The Threat to Reason
Atheists of Silicon Valley
Blag Hag
Rationally Speaking
Bad Science
Enemies of Reason
Tabloid Watch
Daily Mail Watch
Perpetual Motion
Skepticblog
This is What a Scientist Looks Like
Freethought Blogs
Crooked Timber
Kenan Malik
Atheism: Proving the Negative
Stoicism Today
Sense about Science
Evolution
Why Evolution is True
The Panda's Thumb
Pharyngula (SciB)
Pharyngula (FtB)
RichardDawkins.net
The Voyage of HMS Beagle
Evolving Thoughts
The Lancelet
Pleiotropy
The Digital Cuttlefish
Glenn Morton's Pages
Talk.Origins
Creation Science and Earth History
Creation 'Science' Debunked
ASA
The GeoChristian
NCSE
BCSE
Oolon Colluphid's Guide to Creation
Recovering YECs
Beyond the Firmament
Highly Allochthonous
Caught in a Bad Project
Playing Chess with Pigeons
Shit You Didn't Know About Biology
War and Revolution
Antiwar.com
Lenin's Tomb
Empire Burlesque
CounterPunch
World Socialist Web Site
British Army Rumour Service
Circling the Lion's Den
International Crisis Group
Baghdad Burning (Riverbend)
Iraq Today
Left I on the News
Informed Comment
Informed Comment Global
Tom Dispatch
It's No Accident
Empire Notes
the eXile
The Exiled
Inanities
Matt Carr's Infernal Machine
MidEast Shuffle
The Duck of Minerva
In the Mind Field
Mutualist Militants
Free Market Anti-Capitalism
Larry Gambone
Red Lion Press
crispin sartwell
In the Libertarian Labyrinth
Liberty Alone
Rad Geek People's Daily
Propaganda Lalaland
Markets Not Capitalism
Democratic Socialists
Scottish Labour
Tom Harris MP
Bob Piper
LabourList
Socialist Party, USA
Socialist Webzine
Chartist
Appeal to Reason
Labour and Capital
Left Futures
grimmerupnorth
The Bickerstaffe Record
The Socialist International
Labour Lords
Scarlet Standard
Shifting Grounds
Renewal
Impossibilists and Ilk
SLP
SPGB
Socialist Studies
Socialism or Your Money Back
Inveresk Street Ingrate
Vaux Populi
Mission
Timid Maximalist
Class Warfare
Reasons to be Impossible
Mailstrom
Ragged Trousered Philanthropist
Wobbly Times
Viva La Quarta
International Viewpoint
In Defence of Marxism
SWP
Socialist Worker (UK)
Socialist Worker (US)
International Socialism
Socialist Action (US)
CWI
AWL
Anti-SEP-tic
Socialist Action
Communist Parties
CP of Britain
CP of Ireland
CPUSA
CPI(M)
Iraqi CP
CP of Israel
SACP
ML Today
SolidNet
21centurymanifesto
Revolting Europe
L'Humanite in English
Other revolutionaries
CPGB
Worker-communist Party of Iran
the commune
Radical Resources
Housmans Bookshop
Morning Star
Critiques of Libertarianism
Hitler was a Capitalist
Labournet UK
China Labour Review
Marxists Internet Archive
From Marx to Mao
Leninist.biz
Autodidact
Amiel & Melburn Trust
The New Reasoner
Lawrence & Wishart
hegemonics
Marxsite
Marxmail
Marx Myths
Revolutionary History
Monthly Review
What Next?
William Blum
Grover Furr
Bertell Ollman
What's Left
Reality
Paul Cockshott
Critique
The Socialism Web Site
Spectrezine
21st C. Socialism
SolidarityEcon
Left Atomics
Socialist Economic Bulletin
naked capitalism
Thoughts on Economics
Debunking Economics
Research on Money and Finance
Southall Black Sisters
Ancient Communism
Key Trends in Globalisation
Readable Reds
Splintered Sunrise
Soviet Goon Boy
Renegade Eye
Dave's Part
Cedar Lounge
Unrepentant Marxist
Though Cowards Flinch
Mark Steel
Critical Montages
The Curmudgeon
A few words before we go
Stephen Gowans
Liam Mac Uaid
Socialist Unity
Southpaw Punch
Harpy Marx
Madame Miaow
Reading the Maps
Stroppy Blog
A Very Public Sociologist
Tendance Coatsey
Boffy's Blog
Penny Red
Show Biz Red
Stalin's Moustache
Lipstick Socialist
For the sake of the argument
Norman Geras
Sean Gabb
Libertarian Alliance (Official)
Libertarian Alliance (Provisional)
Libertarian Party UK
Spiked Online
Poumista
![[Powered by Blogger]](https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/blogger_img_proxy/AEn0k_uVFJdxUP4KLf2oPbBjIcvXZnNpG4X8L56D7SFO7unz83Xabg6T6Mn_EIpgXbWix6JtXkXU1aj4sZnMUp0360AnegQHa6zMremaoKlAU4fc=s0-d){kind=small}
Skiffy skeptics
I suppose every job has its taxi driver question, and for SF writers it's: 'Do you believe in all that, then?'
'Believe in all what?'
'You know - little green men.' (Or flying saucers, or whatever.)
The first time this happened my lengthy explanation was trumped by the driver saying, 'I gave that Erich von Daniken a lift once.'
I've heard it said that SF fans tend to be more sceptical of UFOs and paranormal claims generally than most people, but in my teens I certainly wasn't, so it's cheering to see tale of how a bit of outreach can change someone's mind.
Labels: skiffy
11 Comments:
Long ago, I gave a (decidedly negative) talk about von Daniken and his crazy theories to my "History of Anthropological Thought" class. I was pleased that no one else in the class seemed to have heard of him, but also a bit worried that they might become interested in him after my talk!
By 
Claire Connelly, at
Tuesday, September 22, 2009 7:06:00 am
Claire - that was exactly my experience in the Hisotry of Anthro Thought I taught in Birmingham. . .
You're not me, are you?
It can be done. I once heard a guy called Tim Taylor give a talk about Graham Hancock, from which I learnt
a) that Hancock is a loon of the first water
and, more importantly
b) quite a lot about diffusionism.
My old man used to read a lot of Isaac Velikovsky, who doesn't seem to have had Von Daniken's staying power. Maybe he didn't have such good illustrations.
I was about to dispute that, having the notion that it was the other way round, but Google returns twice as many hits for von Daniken as for Velikovsky. Maybe the difference is that Velikovsky impressed people who were better educated than those bamboozled by von Daniken, because Velikovsky had a more scholarly-looking base of research.
I think velikovsky just had the misfortune to be too early, he helped keep it all going or kick start the modern phase of such looniness. Plus, although I've not read much by him, finding his style too impenetrable (Which wouldn't help popularity) his ideas were in some ways not hand wavy enough and were roundly rebutted by the science community of the time, or so I have read.
Whereas Daniken came along a little later and wrote nice easy to read books which were not quite as specific, left the reader to fill in the gaps and much easier to read and more user friendly in size.
Of course he too has been panned in various ways, but by then it was too late.
He has been overtaken by the modern equivalent, your leigh and Baigent, Knight and Lomas, the pyramidiots of various stripes and so on.
There is a whole alternative reality out there which as far as I can see does not intersect the world of the SF fan, i.e. UFO's and paranormal stuff have lost all links to SF in the last few decades. The woosters and others have created a self re-inforcing paradigm which utilises pseudo-science to give a veneer of respectability, but is the usual madness. Look up ORMUS for example.
(my name is guthrie but it is not accepting my login)
May the Non-Existent Gods of Puny Earth bless Von D, even so. He did a hell of a lot for me when I was about 13; not least, a fascination with his books showed me that it's possible to see a story completely differently ...
... in other words, it's possible to write fiction.
- Mat C
Mat - von Daniken certainly shook me up at about that age, too, though not in the same way. I was more of a literalist.
guthrie - As far as I know the main continuing intersection of trad-SF fandom and paranormal stuff might be Fortean Times, partly because FT has adopted the fannish style of organising (pages and pages of readers' letters; the annual Unconvention) and partly because Charles Fort influenced quite a few SF writers. I first became aware of Fort through reading Eric Frank Russell.
(And, of course, FT is a cut above the usual credulous guff about these subjects.)
While von Daniken's and his fellow pseudo-historians should be spurned and laughed at, I do admit that some of their material makes for great pulp, conspiracy, and horror (especially Cthulhu Mythos) material for role-playing games.
By Mark A. Siefert, at
Tuesday, September 29, 2009 8:46:00 pm
Sadly that taxi driver is likely to believe that he has now driven both a "crazy Sci-Fi" guy and a serious scientist around...
I remember when I was in my early teens, keen on SF (and had just read and been blown away by 'Chariots of the Gods') having a heated argument with my dad about UFOs and how "some of them are real", backed up with photos of flying hubcaps and vacuum cleaner bits from some "UFOs Exposed!" tome I was reading at the time. I still blush with embarrassment at the memory, and I only wish I'd remembered to apologise to him in later years, before it was too late.
By
Anonymous, at
Monday, September 21, 2009 11:58:00 pm